Cool Stars 14 - Submitted Abstract # 13 This version created on 05 October 2006 How accurately can we determine stellar parameters: The case of Teff in F and G type stars Frank Grupp, University Observatory Munich Lyudmila Mashonkina, Institute of Astronomy of Russian Academy of Science Thomas Gehren, University Observatory Munich The accuracy when testing stellar evolution models depends on the evolutionary model on the one hand and on the accuracy of stellar parameters on the other. This talk will concentrate on the matter of stellar effective temperature determination as one of the most important stellar parameters and show how much different methods depend on models and methods used. Based on my opacity sampling model atmosphere code MAFAGS-OS (Astron. Astrophys. 426, 309-322 & Astron. Astrophys. 420, 289-305 ) I will show the uncertainties in temperature determination arising from the following concepts: Balmer line profiles Infrared Flux Method Theoretical colours Beside the effect of transiting from the most commonly used ODF models to the more advanced opacity sampling models, the effect of NLTE and different resonance broadening theories on Hydrogen Balmer lines, as well as the influence of new atomic bound-free cross section data will be shown. The 'sad' conclusion is, that uncertainties related to models and methods alone are larger than 100K. Especially the IRFM is not as model independent as sometimes suggested. The stated error budget is related to pure model input error and assumes 'perfect' observational data. With real data the situation gets even worse. The influence of such uncertainties on abundance determinations is shortly discussed at the end of the talk. Finally, the need for better verification and calibration of the spectroscopic and photometric methods of parameter determination is shown. Ideas of how to achieve this goal are presented. ----------------------------------